Preview

Comparing Plato's Ischomachus 'Conversation With Socrates'

Good Essays
Open Document
Open Document
503 Words
Grammar
Grammar
Plagiarism
Plagiarism
Writing
Writing
Score
Score
Comparing Plato's Ischomachus 'Conversation With Socrates'
Ischomachus exam question (from 2006)

(c) To what extent do you think Ischomachus treats his wife as a partner in the way he explains her role to her? Explain your answer with reference to this passage and the rest of Ischomachus’ conversation with Socrates.

I do not believe Ischomachus, on the whole, treats his wife as a partner in the way he explains her role to her. First and foremost the entire dialogue between Socrates and Ischomachus is based on a conversation Ischomachus had with his wife, in which she speaks very rarely. It seems Ischomachus is instructing her of her duties, rather than discussing them and sharing them, hence this is not working as a partnership. This can be particularly seen when he uses the leader bee analogy in which he tells his wife that her role is to send out the worker bees and ensure that all the bees in the household are fulfilling their proper roles. The wife is instructed that these are her duties and has no say in the matter; hence I believe this does not show partnership.
…show more content…

The passage given goes on to say that the women’s’ role is indoors and a man’s outdoors, and if “anyone does anything contrary to the nature the god gave him … he will pay the penalty…” Ischomachus seems to be scaremongering or threatening his wife in to believing she must remain indoors and perform the duties ascribed to her by the Gods. This again does not show Ischomachus working in partnership with his wife when discussing the duties ascribed to her as she has no choice in her

You May Also Find These Documents Helpful

  • Good Essays

    The husband’s government ought to be gentle and easy, and the wife’s obedience ready and cheerful. The husband is called the head of the woman. It belongs to the head to rule and govern. Wives are part of the house and family, and ought to be under the husband’s government. Yet his government should not be with rigor, haughtiness, harshness, severity, but the greatest love, gentleness, kindness, tenderness that may be. Though he governs her, he much not treat her as a servant, but as his own flesh; he must love her as…

    • 614 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    Socrates beforehand disproving Gorgias and Polus in The Gorgias, now takes on a rival who he deems qualified enough: Callicles. Here, they discuss the value of temperance and the indulgence of pleasures. Callicles remarks to Socrates, “In the rightly-developed man the passions ought not to be controlled, but that we should let them grow to the upmost and somehow or other satisfy them, and that that is virtue” (Plato 74). Callicles says that to allow growth and indulge in your desires is real virtue. A man who is slave of his own restraint cannot be happy. According to him, satisfying longings is natural and even noble, but because the weaker cannot attain this and are ashamed of their own weakness, they reprimand intemperance and instead praise…

    • 329 Words
    • 2 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Satisfactory Essays

    This reading is so confusing, I read it three times and still have some confusion about the Socrates statements. Basically, it is a conversation or arguments between Socrates and Euthyphro. Socrates is in the court because a man whose name is Meletus prosecuted him about corrupting the youth. Therefore, Euthyphro is in the court to prosecute his father for the murder of the servant. It is not proven that his father is killer but Euthyphro is trying to get justice on behalf of the servant. Euthyphro thinks that a person has to pay if he/she does something impiety. Euthyphro explains that piety is something the dear to god and impiety is the thing that you do and god does not like. Euthyphro is trying to explain Socrates that he has knowledge…

    • 269 Words
    • 2 Pages
    Satisfactory Essays
  • Satisfactory Essays

    In comparison, Sources C and E feel that the women’s role in society is important and is useful especially for a man and his children. Source E states “as with the commander of an army, or the leader of an enterprise so is it with the mistress of the house”. This shows that the role of women is considered as respectable for women to have and as vital in the home as the reputable statuses such as ‘commander’ is in their respective fields. Also, Source C states “though passionate duty love” This shows the role of women as ‘angels in the house’ is something that is expected and that women should be proud and happy that they are able to be good wives and successfully please their husbands and ultimately complete their ‘duties’.…

    • 636 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Satisfactory Essays
  • Good Essays

    Socrates and Euthyphro unexpectedly run into each other outside of the Athens courthouse. Euthyphro went to the courthouse to prosecute his father for killing one of his servants, who was a murderer. Socrates was summoned to court to be charged with disturbing the youth. After Euthyphro stated his business at the courthouse, Socrates assumes that he must be a religious expert if he is willing to prosecute his own father on such a serious charge. Euthyphro then agrees with Socrates that he does indeed know all there is to know about what is holy. Socrates asks Euthyphro to teach him what holiness is, in hope that it will help with his trial.…

    • 516 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    She made it clear in each of her marriages that she was the one in charge. This should be considered a virtue of hers, because if a man attempted to dump all of the household workload on her while he sat around relaxing, she would stand up for herself and force him to do the work. The Wife, however, could sometimes take the belief of the wife playing the dominant role in the marriage too far. She made her first three husbands feel as though it were always their fault, and would not take responsibility for her actions. Chaucer describes the woman as “somewhat deaf, which was a pity” (456). This could perhaps symbolize her ignorance to her husband’s complaints and issues, for the pure reason that she thinks the husband should submit to the will of the wife. The wife would nearly put herself on a pedestal, and would use her husband’s money to buy herself elegant clothing. However, the Wife clearly was not satisfied with one man to marry. The author writes, “She’d had five husbands, all at the church door, / Apart from other company in youth” (470). This unquestionably demonstrates her deadly sin:…

    • 511 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    Women in the Odessey

    • 958 Words
    • 3 Pages

    One role of women in ancient Greek culture as portrayed in The Odyssey is subservient to men. For example, Calypso keeps Odysseus on her island. However, Zeus tells her to let him go, as Hermes declares, “Now Zeus commands you to send him off with all good speed” (5: 156. 125). She responds by protesting that Zeus keeps all the mortal women he wants. However, Calypso listens to Zeus and releases Odysseus. Calypso clearly wants Odysseus to stay, yet she still lets him go, on the orders of Zeus. Even though she is correct in saying the gods are unfair, Calypso must obey Zeus because he is a god. Earlier in the story, we hear Telemachus arguing with the suitors. He tells them he will find news of Odysseus. He also proclaims, “[I will] give my mother to another husband” after he has found news of his father (2: 100. 248). The phrasing, “give my mother,” implies that it is Telemachus’s choice not Penelope’s choice who and when she will marry. Despite the fact Penelope is older; she has to listen to Telemachus, since he is the man of the house. Later in the story, Telemachus again asserts his authority in the hall by saying, “go back to your quarters. Tend to your own tasks, /the distaff and the loom, and keep the women/working hard as well” (21: 435. 390-392) Not only does it show Telemachus’s power; it also shows the job of a woman, which is to spin in their free time. In addition, while the men are feasting and enjoying themselves, the women have to keep working. The women have…

    • 958 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    In this Essay, I would be outlining the dialogue held by Socrates and Euthyphro, Both Socrates and Euthyphro were in court, one facing charges on impiety the other, and the came to prosecute his own father. Socrates decided to have chat with Euthyphro regarding piety so that he can get points or to win the case against Meletus. Moreover, Euthyphro himself stated that he knows what is holy and unholy as Euthyphro was a man considered educated in religious affairs. Also Euthyphro claimed to be all wise, which would make him a Sophist, But Socrates made no claims and declared himself uneducated, so he questioned Euthyphro regarding piety in order expose him on how silly his statement seem to be. Both of them were having an argument where Euthyphro…

    • 580 Words
    • 3 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Satisfactory Essays

    Love – more a duty to her husband - not as strong a value as in Shakespear…

    • 411 Words
    • 2 Pages
    Satisfactory Essays
  • Good Essays

    Sappho considers married life to be inadequate when compared to life with the women she had grown up with. The pressure to…

    • 1050 Words
    • 5 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    6 Act 2 Scenes 1 And

    • 1273 Words
    • 4 Pages

    G) Who brings up the idea of marriage? Give lines to show this. What do you think of her at this point in the play?…

    • 1273 Words
    • 4 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    Even those who were seemingly more protective of women still believed that marriage required an imbalance in order to be prosperous. The Assyrians (Document 1) implemented laws which protected married women from other men, but still gave husbands the ability to divorce and take everything with them (wives could not divorce). In Catholicism, husbands were required to love their wives, as the central rule of the religion stipulated. However, as St. Paul wrote, husbands loved their wives as Christ loved the Church (Document 5). Just as the Church needs Christ for guidance, a woman needs a husband in order to be holy and clean. For a religion that, today, claims that everyone is equal in the eyes of God, it is astonishing that St. Paul taught that husbands had a role similar to Christ in marriage. Aristotle shared a similar belief that husbands, were in some way holy. He claims a married woman is fortunate, and that a husband’s wishes “are as laws appointed for [a wife] by divine will” (Document 3). Finally, in Confucianism, marriage was thought of to be sacred and vital, but must be imbalanced. Husband and wife is one of the five “key relationships” of Confucianism, relationships that Confucius viewed as the building blocks of society. These relationships were examined and widely celebrated, but each consisted of a clear superior and subordinate. In Confucianism, as…

    • 823 Words
    • 4 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Good Essays

    Athenian Marriage

    • 841 Words
    • 4 Pages

    Firstly, Ischomachus’ conversation with Socrates details the relationship Ischomachus maintains with his wife. Ischomachus claims to of effectively trained his wife to perform her duties brilliantly and without needed his input anymore. He calls her the ‘queen bee’ of the household keeping all the ‘worker bees’ or slaves in line and on task. This is important because it shows how much it meant to Ischomachus how good she was at running the household without his guidance, he could even show off his wife and her capability to Socrates and enjoy not having a troublesome wife who was useless at her duties. Although he claims to love her deeply he is much more preoccupied with the idea that he has trained her successfully in order to be of more use to their relationship and lifestyle.…

    • 841 Words
    • 4 Pages
    Good Essays
  • Powerful Essays

    Along with being a wife it is the womens job to take care of her children. The men are traditionally out fighting wars as seen in Homer 's Odyssey. In this poem Sappho refers to her daughter as a "Golden Flower"., which shows the deeply personl love she has for her daughter. Sappho Says "I wouldn 't take all od Croseus kingdom with love thrown in for her." She implies that there is no amount of love, even a kingdom that can match her love for her daughter Cleis. Sappho portrays the women…

    • 962 Words
    • 4 Pages
    Powerful Essays
  • Good Essays

    In this essay, I explicate connections between Socrates’ descriptions of himself and his role as a citizen and educator in his home city, Athens, as portrayed in Plato’s Apology. The Apology depicts the trial of Socrates, and its entirety is narrated from the point of view of Socrates. Therefore, in the account of this trial, we have a lens through which we can view Socrates’ ideologies and convictions. Additionally, because Socrates is speaking directly to a jury of five hundred and one Athenians, from this dialogue we can interpret how Socrates saw his life and purpose in relation to Athens and her people through his direct interaction with them.…

    • 1593 Words
    • 7 Pages
    Good Essays